I wanted to see if the figures on PTSD with Marines was as bad as they were or have become worse. While the figures are not good indicating they have gotten worse, as predicted by the study the Army did on the risk associated with redeployments, I managed to find some hope. I found this on a Marine site. The question is, how many are really reading it? How many are using the links provided? Do they even know it's there?
Mental Health Problems
Overview What to Look For What to Do What to Avoid What to Expect Troubleshooting Marine Not Getting Along With Others
Overview
A Marine having trouble getting along with peers at work may be angry or dissatisfied with his work situation or peers; or may be upset about something outside of work entirely. There may be relationship or financial problems. It may be a personality conflict within the unit or maladaptive personality traits in that Marine. It may be a more serious mental health problem, or something that could become one if not treated early. In any case, problems getting along with others in the unit are a red flag that something needs to be done. Getting help before the problem becomes too big can get a disruptive Marine back on track and help the unit perform well again.
What to Look For
Not getting along with others.
Pushing others' buttons.
Disrupting the workplace.
Angry outbursts.
Defiant attitude.
Fighting.
Passive-aggressive behavior (e.g. “forgetting" to do things).
Malicious compliance (overdoing basic tasks following the “letter of the law” to a harmful degree.)
What to Do
The first line of action should be at the lowest and simplest level possible to get your Marine back on track, and then take further actions as needed. Unless you feel the Marine is at risk for hurting himself or others, first see if he has a problem you can solve through leadership and listening. Here are some things you can do if one of your Marine seems to be having a mental health issue:
Observe the Marine and see what you think may be the problem.
Privately and directly ask how the Marine is doing at a time that maximizes the Marines likelihood to talk.
Use active listening skills so that the Marine will open up.
If reluctant to talk, help the Marine understand that you are concerned about what you see and you want to help.
Listen closely for what may be the underlying problems.
Suggest some possibilities (sounds like you are having problems with…).
If you think the Marine might be suicidal, take appropriate action.
If a problem is identified, ask if the Marine would like some help with it and what type of help would be useful.
In order to reduce the stigma of asking for help, it is recommended that you initially refer your Marine to someone other than mental health, unless you feel they are at risk of harming themselves or others.
In many cases, formal mental health intervention is not necessary. The Marine may respond well to leadership concern at the small unit level. Changes that may be helpful:
Changing the work environment or climate.
Increasing leadership skills of supervisors
Reinforce or acknowledge good work done by the Marine
Increase availability of unit leaders to talk with Marines who may be having trouble adjusting to a new duty station, having problems at home, relationship issues, or financial problems, etc.
When problems are beyond the scope of unit leaders to handle referrals can be made to the unit chaplain, Marine and Family Services or to mental health.
What to Avoid
The idea is for leaders to let their Marines know they are safe and in good hands if they ask for help. If you can communicate your genuine concern for your Marines they will tell their fellow Marines that seeing you was the right thing to do and that you had their best interests in mind. Here are some things to avoid that might destroy their trust, close the lines of communication, or deter other Marines from asking for help in the future:
Minimizing or not taking the problem seriously. Saying “is that all?”
Overreacting to the problem.
Giving simplistic advice. Saying “all you have to do is…”
Telling the Marine to “suck it up,” or “get over it.”
Keeping the problem to yourself rather than getting the appropriate chain of command involved.
Telling personnel who do not have to know, making the problem a source of unit gossip.
Ignoring the problem and hoping it will go away.
Delaying a necessary referral for more specialized help.
What to Expect after Taking Action
Most Marines will respond positively to unit leaders taking an interest in their problems if it is done with their best interests in mind.
The Marine will get assistance from the agency to which they were referred, and that agency will send them to the next higher level of intervention if needed, such as a mental health clinic.
Agencies above the level of a rest and recuperation unit may not give feedback to the command on the Marine's progress unless the Marine specifically gives them permission to do so.
The Marine should be willing to keep leaders apprised of general progress with the problem so far as it affects unit readiness, but is not obligated to divulge every detail.
Troubleshooting
Marine does not endorse a problem: In order to help a Marine who is reluctant to disclose a problem you may want to reassure the Marine, convincingly and genuinely, that you have the best of intentions and only want to help. You want to see the Marine get better not only because you are concerned about what you have seen and heard, but also because you want the Marine to take care of the problem before the problem gets out of hand and starts affecting performance as well as the readiness of the unit. Emphasize to the Marine that you are all in this together. When one Marine hurts the whole unit hurts. Therefore, it is important for you to make sure that the Marine is doing well and not just having to suck it up. You may also want to emphasize that getting help is a sign of strength and loyalty to the unit because they are making sure that they are ready to be there for fellow Marines and would want fellow Marines to do the same. If the Marine continues to be reluctant in disclosing the problem reinforce that you are always available to talk if they should change their mind.
Marine gets angry when asked about his problem: If the Marine gets angry when asked about the problem it may be due to several factors. For example, the Marine may be ashamed of having the problem noticed, resentful due to feelings that the unit is the problem, or may feel that nobody can understand or help with the problem. The Marine may also place blame on themselves for the problem or perhaps feel guilty for not getting a grip on life. Take this opportunity to turn the emotion toward getting help. The trick is to get the Marine to endorse frustration and sadness and realize that problem solving is not a solo operation. Keep the focus on what your Marine is feeling. Do not accuse the Marine of not giving 100 % this will only increase anger. Say, “you seem really angry about…” to show your understanding and promote discussion. If you can get the Marine to endorse the anger, you can probably get acknowledgment that help would be welcomed. In order to get the Marine to accept help from the command the Marine will need to trust that the command is truly interested in helping. Good listening will go a long way toward building this trust.
Marine does not want help: In this case the Marine has endorsed that there is a problem, does not want help. He may or may not say why, but it is probably because he does not want other people in his business, or he is afraid of what will happen if he seeks help. Reassure the Marine, convincingly and genuinely, that you have his best interests in mind. You want to see him get better not only because you are concerned about what you have seen and heard, but also because you want him to take care of the problems before they get big enough to start affecting his performance and career, as well as the readiness of the unit. Stress that you are all in this together - when one Marine hurts the whole unit hurts, so it is in their best interests to make sure he is doing well and not just having to suck it up. You may also want to stress that getting help is a sign of strength and loyalty to the unit, by making sure he is there for them. He would want his fellow Marines to do the same.
Marine agrees to get help but does not follow through: Sometimes a Marine will agree to get help, but for any number of reasons may not follow through. The Marine may decide the problem is not bad enough and can fix it alone. The Marine may have agreed to get help just to get out of your office, or may have genuinely forgotten the time of the appointment. In any case the solution is to put the responsibility onto the Marine to get the needed help. Emphasize that you genuinely want to see your Marine get better, and listen to any concerns shared. Offer again to help. If there is resistance to your help, emphasize that the bottom line is performance, and that it is ultimately the Marine's responsibility to take advantage of all the help that is offered so that the problem does not start to affect performance. Be sure the Marine understands that letting the problem fester and get worse is what will negatively affect progression.
Marine does not get better after getting help: In some cases a Marine may get help but still not improve. This may be because the Marine is not motivated to improve, because the Marine's needs are different, because more intensive intervention is needed, or because there is a more serious problem such as a personality disorder or mental illness. If you are not having any success at the small unit level, and you feel like you have given it a good effort, and the Marine should be referred to a professional with more specialized expertise. In cases of adjustment problems, the Chaplains or Marine and Family Services have counselors who can usually get to the root of the problem. If not, they will recognize that the problem is more serious, such as clinical depression or anxiety, and will refer them for mental health evaluation and treatment. If after mental health intervention the Marine is still not getting better, and the Marine is still a problem for their unit, mental health will usually contact the command with a recommendation for administrative action.
Marine seems mentally ill or suicidal but refuses evaluation: See Command Directed Evaluation.
http://www.usmc-mccs.org/LeadersGuide/Emotional/MHProblems/
notgettingalong.htm
There have been some famous cases like Joshua Omvig, Jonathan Schulze and the recent one of Steven Vickerman,
March 1, 2008
After two tours in Iraq with the Marine Corps Reserve, Steven Vickerman tried to resume a normal life at home with his wife, but he could not shake a feeling of despair.
His parents, Richard and Carole Vickerman of Palisades, went to visit him at a veterans hospital after he suffered a mental breakdown; they were in disbelief. The funny and adventurous baby brother had become sullen, withdrawn and full of anxiety. Vickerman, who was suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder, killed himself Feb. 19.
http://www.lohud.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2008803010370
but did you know about these?
“Suicide by cop”: Marine provokes police shootout to avoid return to Iraq
By Kevin Kearney and John Andrews
15 January 2005
On January 8, 19-year-old Andres Raya, a US marine, killed one police officer and seriously wounded another before being shot dead in his hometown of Ceres, a small agricultural community near Modesto in northern California. The apparent motive was Raya’s determination not to return to duty in Iraq.
Raya, who fought in Fallujah last spring, returned from Iraq in September for a holiday visit. His mother, Julia Cortez Raya, told the Modesto Bee, “He came back different.”
Raya complained several times to his family that he did not want to return to Iraq. On January 2, Raya reported to Camp Pendleton to reunite with his unit. Last Saturday, January 8, Raya said he was stepping out to get something to eat and never returned. A day later he was back in Ceres with an SKS assault rifle, a Chinese version of the weapon he was trained to use in the military.
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2005/jan2005/mode-j15.shtml
Fall from I-5 overpass believed to be a Marine suicide
By: North County Times Saturday, August 18, 2007 10:21 PM PDT ∞
OCEANSIDE ---- Authorities say a man's fall from an overpass at Camp Pendleton on Saturday night was believed to be a suicide.
California Highway Patrol officials said the man, who fell from the Basilone Road overpass onto Interstate 5, was likely a local Marine.
At 6:27 p.m., CHP got word of a man sitting on the ledge of the overpass with his back to the traffic, according to dispatch logs.
Witnesses reported that the man slowly leaned backward off the bridge and fell onto a trailer towed by a pickup truck. He fell again into the roadway and was soon struck by another car, officials said.
The man, whose name has not been released, was declared dead at the scene. Authorities said he left a car on the bridge.
Freeway lanes were temporarily closed, backing up traffic for about six miles, officials said.
http://www.nctimes.com/articles/2007/08/19/news/coastal/22_15_228_18_07.txt
Marine's death may have been suicide
Updated: Feb 6, 2008 11:25 PM EST
Lance Corporal Johnathon Goffred
Greenwood - Investigators are looking into whether a Marine from Greenwood took his own life.
A military spokesman told the Daily Journal in Johnson County that circumstances of Lance Corporal Johnathon Goffred's death indicate he took his own life, but his death has not been ruled a suicide.
The 22-year-old Center Grove graduate was found dead in his barracks in California last month. His funeral was held Tuesday.
http://www.wthr.com/Global/story.asp?S=7835248
Wrongful death suit filed against VA in Mass. soldier’s suicide
By Associated Press
Thursday, July 26, 2007 - Added 232d 10h ago
WASHINGTON - The family of an Iraq war veteran from Massachusetts filed a lawsuit Thursday accusing Veterans Affairs Secretary Jim Nicholson of negligence in the suicide death of their son.
The lawsuit says the VA is to blame for the death of 23-year-old Jeffrey Lucey, a Marine who killed himself in June 2004 after he allegedly was denied mental health care following a tour in Iraq.
http://www.bostonherald.com/news/regional/view.bg?articleid=1013554
There are more. These are just a tiny bit of the Marines paying the price for the attitude of commanders, the attitude of their brothers and the mind set of the general public. Marines are supposed to suck it up, get over it, or they are kicked out.
Troubled troops in no-win plight
Former Marine sniper Chris Packley works on a highway construction project in Lansing, Illinois. By John Zich, USA TODAY
Chris Packley returned from Fallujah in 2004 a top marksman on a sniper team showcased in the Marine Corps Times for its 22 kills.
"I was exceptionally proud of that Marine," says Gunnery Sgt. Scott Guise, his former team leader.
He also came home with flashbacks ? memories of his friend, Lance Cpl. Michael Blake Wafford, 20, dying on the battlefield. Packley says he smoked marijuana to try to escape the images. He also left the base without permission. "I wanted out," Packley says.
Last year he got his wish and was expelled from the Marine Corps. As a consequence, he lost access to the free counseling and medication he needed to treat the mental wounds left from combat, according to Packley, his former defense lawyer and documents from the Department of Veterans Affairs.
Scores of combat veterans like Packley are being dismissed from the Marines without the medical benefits needed to treat combat stress, says Lt. Col. Colby Vokey, who supervises the legal defense of Marines in the western USA, including here at Camp Pendleton.
When classic symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) arise ? including alcoholism and drug abuse ? the veterans are punished for the behavior, Vokey says. Their less-than-honorable discharges can lead to a denial of VA benefits. Vokey calls it a Catch-22, referring to the no-win situation showcased in Joseph Heller's 1961 satirical war novel Catch-22.
"The Marine Corps has created these mental health issues" in combat veterans, Vokey says, "and then we just kind of kick them out into the streets."
Characters in Catch-22 were caught in a contradiction. They could be relieved of dangerous flying missions if crazy. But if they claimed to be crazy, they were deemed sane for trying to avoid danger and had to keep flying.
In Iraq, Marines who perform well in combat can be lauded for it. But if they develop PTSD, they can be punished for stress-related misconduct, kicked out of the military and denied treatment for their illness.
In recent months, the Marine Corps has begun investigating the matter, identifying 1,019 Marines who may fall into this group since the war in Iraq began. All served at least one year in the Marines and one tour overseas before being discharged for misconduct.
"We're digging down into the data sources we have to try and come up with answers," says Navy Capt. William Nash, who coordinates the Marine Corps' combat stress programs. "That it happens at all is obviously not ideal."
He says each case will be examined to learn whether the Marine suffered combat stress and whether that might have contributed to the misconduct.
The results could help the Marine Corps flag combat-stressed Marines and help them avoid getting into trouble, Nash says.
More aggressive about PTSD
The military has moved more aggressively in this war to educate and treat combat stress than in previous conflicts. Mental health teams have been sent to Iraq and Afghanistan. Soldiers and Marines are asked about their mental and physical health before and after their tours.
A 2004 Army study showed that about 17% of combat troops suffer PTSD, a rate comparable with Vietnam-era stress among such troops, says Joseph Boscarino, a senior investigator with the Geisinger Center for Health Research in Danville, Pa., who has conducted extensive PTSD research on Vietnam veterans.
Vokey and his lawyers say they are convinced, based on reviews of medical records, that combat stress was a major factor in the misconduct cases. They argue that either the Pentagon or VA should revise its policies so that these combat veterans are not stripped of the medical care they need to get better.
"People would be appalled if the guy came back and he had lost a leg, lost a limb, and then we say, 'Oh, you had a DUI (driving under the influence), so you're going to have to give your prosthetic back,' " says Marine Capt. James Weirick, a former member of Vokey's staff. "But to a great extent, we're doing that with these people."
Packley, 24, received an other-than-honorable discharge. According to a VA document Packley's mother, Patricia, shared with USA TODAY, the department acknowledges he has PTSD but denied him benefits in July.
"You go to war and they can't even help you with the problems you get from it," says Packley, who now does state highway construction in Joliet, Ill.
He says he has been off anti-anxiety, anti-depression and sleep medications for months because he cannot afford it. "I'm just so stressed," he says. "It doesn't take much to get me almost panic-stricken anymore."
Heroes in trouble
Marine Capt. Mike Studenka, who supervises a law office located amid infantry battalions at Camp Pendleton, says he sees about 40 Marines each month who are in trouble. About a third fit the profile of combat veterans with impressive records who suddenly have drug or alcohol problems and face dismissal and loss of benefits.
"You have guys coming in this building who are, no question about it, heroes in everything that they have done in the past," Studenka says. "You have them saying, 'I just need to get out. I want out.' That breaks your heart."
The Marine Corps says post-traumatic stress disorder is no legal defense to misconduct and that discipline must be maintained.
"PTSD does not force anyone to do an illegal act," Nash says. "The consequences to the Marine Corps of not upholding those standards of behavior would be a much greater tragedy. It would dishonor all those Marines who have been injured by the stress of war but who have not broken the rules."
Marines, sailors, soldiers and airmen who get in trouble can receive one of four discharges. The lightest is a general discharge, often described as "under honorable conditions," in which recipients remain eligible for most VA benefits.
More serious misconduct can lead to an other-than-honorable discharge or, worse, a bad conduct discharge. A serious felony results in a dishonorable discharge.
The law prohibits a veteran from receiving the full spectrum of VA benefits ? such things as health care, insurance and home loans ? in certain cases, such as those involving deserters, conscientious objectors or those who receive dishonorable discharges.
But the VA has discretion to grant full benefits in other-than-honorable or bad conduct discharge cases. It can still deny them if the agency decides the underlying misconduct was "willful and persistent," a largely subjective decision, VA official Jack McCoy says.
Statistics from 1990 through September show that about eight out of 10 veterans who received bad-conduct discharges were turned down when they sought benefits, McCoy says.
Few exceptions
Even if the full package of benefits is denied, the VA can still grant health care for specific war-related injuries such as PTSD. Gary Baker, director of the VA's health eligibility center, says that in his 20 years of experience he has seen this exception granted fewer than six times.
The VA offers temporary counseling, but no medication, for veterans who are appealing their discharges. Counseling ends if the appeal fails. Vokey argues that the VA could relax its practices and treat veterans who are discharged for PTSD-related misconduct.
Mental health experts say this problem almost certainly occurred in prior wars. But combat-induced mental disorders and how they may contribute to bad behavior were not as well understood.
The issue exists today in the Army but to a lesser degree, says Army Lt. Col. John Wells, a former supervising defense lawyer. Combat-stress cases involving misconduct are handled in informal ways that often do not lead to a loss of benefits, Wells says.
The Marine Corps, by comparison, prides itself on its strict standards.
"We take discipline infraction very seriously," says Lt. Col. Scott Fazekas, a Marine Corps spokesman. It prosecutes about the same number of troops as the Army each year for misconduct, though it is only one-third the Army's size.
The Marine Corps also does a disproportionate share of fighting and dying in Iraq, making up 20% of U.S. ground forces while suffering 30% of the casualties. More than 10% of American troops who died in Iraq were Marines from Camp Pendleton, which has lost almost 300, more than any other military base.
Marine Corps statistics, though incomplete, show PTSD cases doubled from about 250 in 2003 to 596 in 2004, and then doubled again to 1,229 in 2005.
Although Marine Corps officials say the service has come a long way in recognizing and treating PTSD, they acknowledge that it still struggles to provide treatment resources and to overcome the stigma against those who suffer mental health problems.
"There might be some commanders out there who aren't really willing to accept that there is such a thing as post-traumatic stress syndrome," says Marine Col. Hank Donegan, a military intelligence officer at Pendleton.
Vokey and his staff agree that many troubled Marines should leave the Marine Corps, for their sake and that of the Corps. To strip them of benefits is wrong, they say. "It seems to me our country has bought that problem and we ought to fix it as best we can," says Melissa Epstein, a Los Angeles lawyer and former Marine captain on Vokey's staff.
A medal winner's trauma
One of those PTSD cases involved Ryan Birrell, 24, who served as a sergeant with the 1st Battalion, 7th Marine Regiment. After his second tour, in 2004-05, he received the Bronze Star with a "V" for combat heroism.
The citation described five separate episodes of valor, including one morning in February 2005 when Birrell organized the defense of a fog-shrouded observation post in Husaybah that came under multiple attacks by insurgents and suicide car-bombers. A wounded Birrell rallied his troops, tended to casualties and directed fire, often while exposed to enemy gunfire.
"Sgt. Birrell reflected great credit upon himself and upheld the highest tradition of the Marine Corps," his citation reads.
After coming home, Birrell took an assignment earlier this year as a drill instructor at the Marine Corps Recruit Depot in San Diego, and his life began to fall apart.
Diagnosed with PTSD, he suddenly demanded a divorce from his wife, abused alcohol and methamphetamine and left his base without permission, say Birrell and Weirick, then his lawyer.
Kicked out of the Marine Corps with an other-than-honorable discharge, he lived in Tijuana, Mexico, for months, often homeless.
"What brought me down there was how the streets were kind of like being in Iraq ? that kind of turmoil-type stuff," Birrell says now.
Birrell says that in Tijuana, he could fill his head with thoughts of where to find food or shelter.
Growing tired of that life, he finally called his parents and they brought him to their home in Las Vegas last month. "Life is great," says his mother, Kim Lukas, who says she's ecstatic to have him home again.
For Birrell, who now lives in Torrance, Calif., insomnia is back. "When I do sleep," he says, "I'm constantly waking up from dreams, constantly tired throughout the day." His nightmares are of war. He visited VA offices Tuesday asking for benefits despite his other-than-honorable discharge. Birrell says he needs treatment for his PTSD. Weirick fears they will turn him down regardless of his battlefield heroism.
Lukas says that makes her angry. "He's done two tours over there, and God knows how many lives he's saved," she says. He's going to need the care."
By Gregg Zoroya, USA TODAY
(Copyright 2006 by USA Today. All Rights Reserved.)
Last Updated: 11/2/2006 12:21:48 PM
http://www.kare11.com/news/health/health_article.aspx?storyid=138190
Normally I don't like to post an entire article but this one was so reliant to the information that needs to be known, there was no place to cut it.
Yet according to the Maines, they were already working on this in 2005.
NCOs learn to combat stress abuse
Aug. 22, 2005; Submitted on: 08/25/2005 06:11:08 PM ; Story ID#: 200582518118
By Staff Sgt. Maria C. Villanueva, MCAS Miramar
MARINE CORPS AIR STATION MIRAMAR, Calif. (Aug. 22, 2005) -- Eight noncommissioned officers from Marine Corps Air Station Miramar represented the air station at the 2005 NCO Substance Abuse Prevention Symposium sponsored by Marine Corps Community Services in Dallas Aug. 16 though 18.
The symposium, the first ever to be offered to NCOs Corpswide, helps junior leaders identify and possibly prevent Marines from turning to mind-altering substances, especially upon return from a combat zone.
The NCOs, the first Marines usually in positions to best identify troops at risk, spent the three days learning how to identify factors that can contribute to substance abuse and programs available to deter and assist those who are at risk.
Helping Marines who suffer from Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder was a common concern for most of the NCOs who attended the symposium, some of whom have been deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan as many as three times in two years.
According to statistics provided by the MCCS Prevention and Intervention Team, there is a 97 percent increase in Marines displaying dependency symptoms to substances like drugs and alcohol. The same statistics also show that those returning from combat zones are more likely to fall into these dependencies without knowing there are programs to assist them.
After serving in Iraq, Cpl. William G. Pollard, finance clerk, MCAS Miramar, noticed his best friend, another Marine, turned to alcohol to deal with domestic issues that arose while the two were deployed. Pollard said the resources that he received at the conference could have better helped him deal with his friend when the situation occurred.
"He was getting into a lot of trouble because of alcohol," said Pollard, a native of Aiken, S.C. "I could have been able to talk to him better and get him help at a lower level."
Sergeant Pablo P. Torrez, motor transport mechanic, 15th Marine Expeditionary Unit, 1st Marine Expeditionary Force, spent six months in Iraq and saw first hand the effects of combat stress on himself, his fellow Marines and overall mission readiness.
Torrez, a native of Keller, Texas, recently helped a fellow Marine deal with readjusting to garrison life after returning from combat. As a direct result of his intervention, Torrez saved the Marine's life.
"(PTSD) is something we should all focus on now," said Torrez. "In the future, I wouldn't second guess myself about getting anyone help."
go here for the rest
http://www.usmc.mil/marinelink/mcn2000.nsf/ac95bc775efc34c
685256ab50049d458/d9c474cc4f8682f2852570680079de90?OpenDocument&Highlight=2,PTSD
There is a lesson to be learned here. While the military trains them all so quickly to kill, they better figure out how to quickly train them to begin to heal.
When regular people are training to take care of trauma victims as well as rescue workers, there is a golden gate of opportunity to begin to tackle what the people went through. While we think of a debrief as what a police officer does after action and talks about tactical things, there is another kind. A debrief is also to address what the person had to deal with, the emotional responses and issue they must cope with, face and begin to heal. In other words, get it out of their mouths before they lock it away in their brains. While we can do this in normal life with abnormal events, we need to begin to ask why the military wouldn't be doing the same thing knowing what works and what does not work. Telling a Marine to get over it, suck it up or suffer for being human is leading to more coffins being filled that would not have to ordered for many more years. The Marine could be treated early after the trauma and returned to duty without the ravages of what they go through begins eating them up alive. It's time to get serious about PTSD before it's too late. Given what was being talked about in 2005, the Marines have not advanced far enough to prove they understand the ramifications of inaction. It's clear the President has not even come close to understanding what any of those who serve under him really have to deal with. It is nothing even close to what he thinks it is.
Kathie Costos
Namguardianangel@aol.com
http://www.namguardianangel.org/
http://www.namguardianangel.blogspot.com/
http://www.woundedtimes.blogspot.com/
"The willingness with which our young people are likely to serve in any war, no matter how justified, shall be directly proportional to how they perceive veterans of early wars were treated and appreciated by our nation." - George Washington
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